Pathways with Amber Stitt

Focus On Marketing: Effective Public Relations for Marketing and Cold Email Campaigns with Carson Spitzke

• Amber Stitt

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🎙️ Welcome to another episode of Pathways with Amber Stitt! 

📖 Today we have a fascinating conversation lined up with a remarkable guest, Carson Spitzke. Carson is an expert in online presence, PR, and a published author. 

📧 In this episode, we'll dive deep into Carson's journey from being a young entrepreneur to mastering the art of public relations and cold emailing. 

💪 We’ll explore how he overcame early challenges, the frameworks he developed for success, and his insights on building authority in any industry. 

🚀 Whether you're a budding entrepreneur or an established business professional, this conversation is packed with actionable advice and insights that can help you grow your business and refine your marketing strategies. 

🔹 What's Inside:

  • Carson’s unique approach to Public Relations and how he cracked the code.
  • The significance of authority and credibility in building a successful online presence.
  • Practical tips on cold emailing—what it is, how to do it legally, and why it’s effective.
  • Strategies for young and seasoned entrepreneurs alike to grow their businesses through intelligent, effective marketing.
  • The importance of sticking to proven methods but also knowing when—and how—to innovate.
  • Insights on leveraging testimonials and social proof to boost credibility.
  • What it means to truly work hard and fail fast to achieve long-term success.

🌟 Key Takeaways:

  1. Identify and leverage your strengths to solve real-world problems.
  2. Consistency and persistence are more valuable than instant gratification.
  3. How to use cold email effectively without coming across as spammy.
  4. The role of authority and credibility in business growth.
  5. The value of knowing your business inside out before delegating tasks.

📚 Books by Carson Spitzke:

      1. The Power of PR: A Guide to Crafting Effective Public Relations Strategies

      2. Marketing Secrets to Win

🔗 Connect with Us:

📽️ Watch the Full Episode: https://youtu.be/4War3sT_cFY

📻 Thank you for tuning into Pathways with Amber Stitt! Let’s take action today to pave the way for a better tomorrow!

#AmberStitt #PathwaysWithAmberStitt #CarsonSpitzke #OnlinePresence #PublicRelations #Entrepreneurship #ColdEmail 

Amber Stitt [00:00:00]:
Hello and welcome to Pathways. I am your host, Amber Stitt, and today we welcome Carson Spitzke to the show today. Welcome, Carson.

Carson Spitzke [00:00:08]:
Thanks for having me, Amber. Good introduction.

Amber Stitt [00:00:11]:
Well, thank you. Now, I know that you are an expert in online presence, PR, and an author. Can we dive into how in the world did you get involved with public relations? What was driving you into that industry? I guess we could call it.

Carson Spitzke [00:00:27]:
Yeah. So nothing really drove me into public relations in particular. Where I got my start is I was really trying to analyze when I started my business journey, entrepreneurial journey, what problem could I solve and what would people pay me for, right? You're not starting a business because you want to do something. You're starting it because ultimately you do want money in some way, shape, or form. I started during 2020, right at the start of Covid. I was playing hockey before, I had got injured a bunch, quit. Covid popped around and a little bit of other backstory, I had graduated high school at 16, so I wasn't really doing anything outside of work for a couple of years.

Amber Stitt [00:01:02]:
Okay.

Carson Spitzke [00:01:03]:
I realized, well, I have never learned in a classroom traditionally, whether if it's online school, or just working in class, ignoring the teacher. So I kind of figured, well, I need to do my own thing. I really doubt I'll be able to work for a boss, or anything like that. Kind of stereotypical. But I went through and I figured out, well, what business model should I do? How should I make my start? And I tested a few different things, right? And I bought into programs. I bought into courses. I bought into get money quick, make 10K per month in 90 days, or something like that, right? And I always knew buying into that stuff, "Is that actually gonna happen for me? Maybe, maybe not. Probably not, actually." But I knew what would happen regardless is I will find skills and I will find strategies in here I can use that once I find what I need to do, that I can use to grow.

Carson Spitzke [00:01:51]:
One of those being cold email, one of those being online presence and positioning. Right? But what stuck out to me is why I was buying and other people were buying too, was like, the person's social media content, or brand got me to realize who they were. So I got in front of them through that, or ads. And the reason why I felt trust, or a bond, was the storytelling and the third party social proof. I bought a course because some guy had a Kevin O'Leary testimonial and the course is relatively inexpensive. So I figured, "Well, why not? Kevin O'Leary trusts it, why not me?" And like, even to this day, I know for a fact if someone is on those media articles, or on tv, or something like that, they are likely more credible, or at least they know the value of their online brand more than someone who doesn't. So long winded answer to basically say, I saw others doing it and I realized if I'm buying off of this, I'm not the dumbest cookie in the tool shed.

Carson Spitzke [00:02:45]:
Let me help other people do this exact same thing so they can make more money.

Amber Stitt [00:02:48]:
Amy Porterfield is one that I all follow, and she has partnered with a different speaking coach that I've hired. And of course I joined that boot camp. Next thing you know, I'm buying Amy's course and then I'm in their email campaign. I'm like, "Oh, they got me." But they got me. And I'll always look at her emails because there's something about her story and her color wheel, like her aesthetics, everything. And it can be the same for me. When I look at influencers like Jenna Kutcher, there's Jasmine Starr, and there's some others that are just completely outside of my industry.

Amber Stitt [00:03:20]:
But, oh, yeah, I'll go down the rabbit hole and be like, I can see the marketing as I'm scrolling, but I'm still there looking around, probably because I'm curious. But like you, you're like, "Okay, I bought this. If I would buy this, someone else might. So how do we then rinse and repeat? Repurpose, but with your own story. So the public relations part came about because you were solving a problem, but with your own experience of kind of training yourself. There's one thing I'm noticing a lot in my, not so much my industry, but as I advocate for more people coming into financial services, is that I feel there's a younger generation of entrepreneurs that are not waiting for classroom to learn some of these things. Like you said, "It was Covid. I'm just going to get online and start looking around."

Amber Stitt [00:04:06]:
I know that I always had a digital business and planning, insurance planning before many did. So I was like, I absolutely have to get smarter, quicker, faster, because there's more competition coming into my marketplace. Offices are closed. But what I do really appreciate about a younger generation from myself is that you guys are getting after it quicker, faster, and like you said, you're reverse engineering. "There's a problem. Let's make money off of solving a problem." I love that. So that takes you into some frameworks you've developed, right?

Carson Spitzke [00:04:35]:
Yeah, it's interesting, right? Because going back to what you said, just with younger generation, I find there's misaligned expectations where they will take initiative, they will take advantage, but they expect things to happen way too quickly. Like I don't know the stats off of this, but I'm pretty sure any type of entry level course that is catered like business to consumer, like to the average person, just getting started has around a 10% to 15% success rate. And I believe the only reason why for that, is just because people give up too fast. They buy for the wrong reasons, they don't necessarily know what they should be doing.

Amber Stitt [00:05:09]:
I wonder though, I think this could be across the board, you look at memberships, retention, forfeiture when it comes to, say, the gym membership. Everybody wants to be fit. You remember it was like beach body before that. Like when I was in college, there was the kickboxing guy, I forget what his name was, but you buy the courses to get fit and then you just don't do it. So that 10% to 15%, I don't know that it's just instant gratification that's been pre-programmed with those of us that have been around with social media and just all the things with the dopamine, with all the apps we have. But I don't know, maybe there is a blanket overall, are people really going to do the work, or they want that instant gratification? So that is an interesting point. And if we throw out like a titan like Tony Robbins, he says, "Consistency, it's not about the smartest, it's being consistent."

Amber Stitt [00:05:59]:
So you do have to give yourself some time, I suppose.

Carson Spitzke [00:06:01]:
Yeah, I completely agree. Like, even retrospectively, I've been analyzing what's been working, what's not been working, because I've been realizing that the months and the seasons where I did the best is when I just kept things simple, did what was working, and either did more of it, or just kept doing it for longer. A couple of things I noticed that I got sidetracked by, I obviously got sidetracked by, "Oh, new service I can offer" or, "New client acquisition method," or, "A new method I can use to fulfill." And the more time I spent building that out, instead of solving what's the actual root problem that I need to hit my goals, which at this time is growth within revenue, client base, higher level clients. By not fixing those problems, I was just spinning my wheels, doing nothing, going up and then going down and then kind of hovering and then maybe going up and then going back down.

Amber Stitt [00:06:49]:
Do you think we as maybe entrepreneurs like a little bit of the crazy, like let's keep tinkering because we want that thrill of something else working, but really stick to the processes that we know and try to maximize and scale the volume there. Is that what you mean?

Carson Spitzke [00:07:05]:
Yeah, I agree in a sense. Basically, there's nothing wrong with split testing, nothing wrong with doing something that's working, trying to optimize it. But it's when you start over on something from scratch and you got to put all the time, like work energy, and you don't even have to, you don't even have a valid reason to actually start from scratch, or add something else. So you're going to have to start from scratch because there's two things: there's operational complexity, and then there's just time. We only have so much in our day.

Carson Spitzke [00:07:30]:
If you're doing stuff that doesn't matter, that you're going to scrap for 30% of the day, you killed 30% of the day for stuff you didn't really need to work on at that point, and then operational...

Amber Stitt [00:07:41]:
But it's so must fun to dabble, right?

Carson Spitzke [00:07:43]:
I still think it's good to test things and do stuff that you enjoy. It just shouldn't be that much of your day.

Amber Stitt [00:07:47]:
So you talk about cold emailing, and I know you wrote about that on one of your books, correct?

Carson Spitzke [00:07:53]:
Yeah.

Amber Stitt [00:07:54]:
So can you define that?

Carson Spitzke [00:07:55]:
Yeah. Cold email. All we really look at for cold email...there's two types of email: there is, I call it warm email. I'm blanking on the term. It's more...Warm email is when you have someone opted in, they've either subscribed to your list, opted in via an ad, or some other form or method, they actively want to see your emails.

Carson Spitzke [00:08:13]:
Cold email, the person has never heard of you before. This can be you just finding a contact email from their website and emailing the website. Now, this is only legal for business purposes, right? Like, you help...You're in the financial service industry. If you wanted to do something where you could find referral partners, I'm sure you could go out there and say, email real estate agents, or email mortgage brokers, or email lawyers and say something like, "Hey, would you want to come on my podcast? I think we can make a good episode together," right? That's perfectly legal. I have seen over the last two, or three years a lot of people like yourself, they're getting a lot more emails in their inbox. I'm sure you probably have noticed this, but I talked to some of my clients and they said, "Oh, when I signed them, you were the first PR email I've ever seen." And then I talk to them now and they say, "I see this every day now. What the heck is happening?"

Carson Spitzke [00:09:03]:
What's been happening is cold email has been democratized, meaning there's a lot less cost to get a lead, a lot less cost to actively send out a lot of emails. All you really need to do, you need to go somewhere like Namecheap, or Godaddy, or somewhere like that. Buy domains that are not your website so you don't harm your actual website. Set up email accounts with Google Workspace, or Outlook, and then use tools like Instantly.AI or Smartly.AI. And both have guides on how to basically do everything start to finish a technical setup, what you should be saying, who you should be targeting, pay them like a couple hundred dollars per month and boom, you can send off 10,000 emails a month, or even per day if you have a bit more budget and you feel like spamming people. And is this the best way to get leads, in my opinion? Well, I'm going to be biased because every person I see online has a mindset of use my lead gen method, don't use others. Mine's the only right way.

Amber Stitt [00:09:58]:
Right, right.

Carson Spitzke [00:09:59]:
For me, it's the best because I know my numbers with PR. I know what I can do to reach out. I know what I can do if I want to target higher end clients. Like if you're going after like Fortune 500 or companies doing above 50 to 100 million, you have to take a way different approach. Can it work with the exact same approach you take from a lower end market? For sure. But you want to be as efficient as possible because each deal is worth 5, 6, 7, 8 figures with them. So it is worth it the extra time. The biggest thing I'm seeing to actually get results with cold email isn't really making it one to one, it's giving something that people actually care about.

Carson Spitzke [00:10:37]:
I mentioned this before. If you said something like, "Hey, could I write a free article on you? Could I get you on my podcast?" Most people would say, "Yes," and you'd get a pretty high of a return rate, too. Or even if you're solving something like a valuable problem and saying it in a unique way, like 90% of people have seen, "Oh, I can help you get more viewers on your website," and they get that every single day versus if you say something...And I'll try and come up with something unorthodox... If you're saying, "Oh, hey, I noticed that the help button wasn't working on your site. This could be potentially leading to you missing out on 50..." I don't know. I don't know what your main service would be.

Carson Spitzke [00:11:12]:
Let's just say for example, like 50 commercial life insurance applications.

Amber Stitt [00:11:16]:
Because your chat box is not working.

Carson Spitzke [00:11:19]:
Whatever, like your highest value client is, you're more likely to reply to that than just, "Can I do your SEO?" or "Can I do your Facebook ads?" or something like that.

Amber Stitt [00:11:27]:
So can you talk about how you help people? Because what I'm hearing is you're helping people polish the message to then be cold in that sense of introducing themselves, but having it be valid and trustworthy and loyal. So it sets them apart from, say, those types of, I'll get them in my inbox, or say like Instagram, and they'll do something similar, acting, alerting me to this problem that's on my blog, or whatever. And I usually just delete those because you could tell with grammar and different things and it's borderline looking like phishing, sometimes because there's other things that are going on. But that's where you do help people with their online presence to then hit this approach, so that they can maximize their entrance in?

Carson Spitzke [00:12:07]:
I would say yes and no because a lot of the businesses I work with, I just view cold email. It works for me, works for my service, works for my offer. Other people, they might have more success just running ads. They might have more success going to networking events like the entire goal of PR and positioning yourself, from what I've seen...there's two different points: It's either someone's never heard of you, into trusted, they think you're an authority. And the reason why being an authority is actually valuable is because if you are looking down on me, like if you think, "Oh, this guy's just some sick 16 year old, never had any clients," you're not really going to believe me if I tell you, "Well, you need to build out your brand," or something like that, you're not going to believe me. You're going to think, "What does this guy know? Why should I believe it?" And first off, you want them to actually listen to your advice, because you cannot sell without being seen as an authority.

Carson Spitzke [00:12:55]:
And the second thing, too, that I look at is, we'll go into financial services, for example, there are huge brands in the financial services space like Northwestern Mutual, or JP Morgan. The average life insurance person, or financial advisor, selling them to those brands has a way easier time than an individual life insurance specialist, or advisor selling under their own personal brand. And the reason why that is, is no one is ever going to feel bad about hiring the big safe brand, company, person, whatever that is. But you have to be that much better than that big brand in order to get hired. That's what I've seen and that's really the biggest problem that I found is solvable through being an authority, getting featured in the media, whatever that may be.

Amber Stitt [00:13:43]:
So I'm curious, when you talk about your origin story essentially, and I said, "Hey, how did you get into PR?" Was there a certain something that you studied, or noticed younger in high school, whatever the story is that you resonated with and you say I am good at more like computer science, or something like that? Did you see a trend, or was this more, "I'm going to figure out how to be an entrepreneur, I'm taking that route."?

Carson Spitzke [00:14:06]:
I didn't really think I was going to be an entrepreneur until I was about 16 or 17. And the reason why was because I was like a typical kid. I went through all the phases of I want to be an astronaut, I want to be a lawyer, I want to be a doctor, all those high paying rich type jobs and then you realize, "Oh wait, there's a ton of work. I don't really like this that much. Oh, I suck at this subject in school. I'm not doing this for another twelve years," that sort of stuff. So I think the only thing that really translated for me, I did skip a grade and I did finish really early in school.

Carson Spitzke [00:14:37]:
I review my unfair advantages is I have really quick, I would say, processing speeds, where I can go in and understand something and regurgitate it a lot faster than the average person. And then I would say in my opinion, like a decent work ethic, maybe it's not as great compared to others, but I would say it got me where I am today. And I would say that compared with I spent a lot of time playing video games. I obviously made it pretty high in hockey. Like I played against the past number one overall pick in the NHL this year.

Amber Stitt [00:15:08]:
I didn't know that as I was getting to meet you, very cool.

Carson Spitzke [00:15:14]:
Well, I wasn't that good, but I just played at a level that they were at the time. But going back to what I was talking about, those things from what I've seen have led to my success today because I view that I consume things and get things quicker and I view more information than the average person and I take action on that information quicker than the average person, as well. I know that what anyone can do to mimic success is consume as much as possible to start and then once you've found something that makes sense, have an action plan, have a next step, execute on it as quickly as possible. Like the biggest thing I've seen, no one wants to fail. I was actually talking about this with my mom when we were on a walk the other day, and we were saying, like Israel, there are so many tech startups that have either hit Unicorn status, which is a billion dollars in valuation, or that are deemed as successful. And why is that? Because in Israeli culture, it's deemed that you need to fail. Like go fail, so you can learn what works. It's not like that here.

Carson Spitzke [00:16:12]:
Everyone's so scared of failing, they're scared of doing.

Amber Stitt [00:16:14]:
Well, I'm poking, almost leading you to focusing on talents, which is what I think is the foundational step I talk about on my podcast, 5 Steps to have Peak Performance, and it's focusing on talents. And when you know, you've witnessed what you are good at. And my point about school is, I don't know that school is always a great indicator of, "Hey, this is what you're going to be when you grow up." And then we're preconditioned to say these 10 jobs are successful. And I've looked at some of those jobs and I'm like, "That's great, but I'd like more than that, with maybe less work." I don't think it has to be what we've always been pre-programmed to believe as success. And like you said, there's a different culture, different country that might be looking at things a little bit differently, too. But what I want to encourage listeners is if something's not resonating yet, but you know that you personally can excel and you develop what you're talented in and have that awareness there...

Amber Stitt [00:17:06]:
I think a lot of people can build any business around finding the problems that people are facing, but plugging your talents in and maybe you can do it initially as a solopreneur, but then you can delegate out. And I think that your story is aligning there where you're noticing and appreciating what you can provide, and then you're maximizing it that way. So do you think the approach with first impressions, how you can approach people with marketing is different at different ages? Do you think that a startup is going to need to do things differently with cold email versus a person starting something new in their 60's? Or is it all the same?

Carson Spitzke [00:17:41]:
I think it's similar. At the end of the day, if you're starting, you want to do anything to get that first client, whether it's working for free, going in through your network, or something else, to get that first case site that's the easiest thing to do. And then once you have proof, you want to document that proof as widely as possible. Like if I was starting out, I was going to get my first ten clients, the framework would be the same every time. Go to my current network, email, call, text as many people as possible that are relevant. Ask if they either know someone that could be a match, or say, "hey, I'm doing this. Can I do it for free? I would just be looking to help you out, kind of gain feedback, improve my service," that cool view. And then assuming you get someone that says, "Yes," just ask them, "Hey, if you like the service, I would just ask. And you leave a video testimonial.

Carson Spitzke [00:18:26]:
And if you want to keep going, let's keep going." At worst, you get a video testimonial that you can then use to target people who fit that exact same ideal client persona. For example, if I was to help you, if you're my first clients and I was to help you get featured on various publications, and that turned into, I don't know, let's say we help you solve the issue of getting in front of your local market, right? Let's say we got you in front of 100,000 people that saw a TV segment, or whatever. I can then go to other insurance agents, brokers, and I can say, "Hey, we recently helped Amber do XYZ. Would you be open to doing this?" Or, "We're even open to doing this for free because we're still looking to improve our service. But we do want you to, you know, pay later." When I mentioned that when I got kind of sidetracked, I actually did this as a service.

Carson Spitzke [00:19:12]:
And that's what we did to grow our agency off of that side service and I offloaded it to one of my friends I mentioned at the beginning of the episode, but we use that to sign 4 or 5 people on the free trials and converted a couple of them into paid retainers, basically. So I have scaled from scratch. That's really what worked for us.

Amber Stitt [00:19:32]:
That's awesome. You've been giving a number of takeaways. I don't know if people really thought about this if they're listening, driving to this episode, but you're basically saying, identify the strength, then you make an action plan from there. How are you going to put and integrate that out there into the world with whatever you're doing? And then don't delay it. If it is working, take action and you want to test it and then copycat that, keep it going. If it's working for the most part. And then we talked about dabbling here and there, but keep that focus where it needs to be. But then do devote some time to testing some other methods.

Carson Spitzke [00:20:08]:
I think the other thing to add, too, is do way more than what you think is needed, at least at the start. Because if someone says, I'll use an example of cold email, "Oh, I'm getting around 5% reply rate, cold email," I know my numbers. And if I'm thinking, oh, I need 5%, you should probably do a lot more than you're expecting. Because at worst, what do you do? You make a waitlist, right, if they actually want to buy.

Carson Spitzke [00:20:30]:
At best, you get the exact amount of people you're expecting. At worst, if you plan to do double, or triple or 5X, what you would anticipate, sure, if it sucks, you still get that volume, then you can figure out what works, what didn't work. Then you can either keep doing that volume as things get better, or do more volume, or you can hire out people to do that volume for you and just arbitrage their time so you don't have to use your time.

Amber Stitt [00:20:54]:
Yeah, because if something's not working, it's still data.

Carson Spitzke [00:20:56]:
Exactly. Yeah. And I think another skill is kind of figuring out when you should scrap something just because data tells you to or whether it's actually worth continually improving and actually making it work.

Amber Stitt [00:21:07]:
Yeah, I really appreciate all this. And we're going to link up how people can find you. Do you mind though, before we wrap up today, talking about your books, because you have two books that are bestsellers on Amazon. Was this around the same time you started your business? Did you develop these and put these together when you were seeing things in action?

Carson Spitzke [00:21:24]:
I co-wrote these with one of my friends, Aidan Sowa. It's weird. We're both in PR. We both use cold email to get clients, but we really don't have overlapping markets, so we share a ton of information with each other and we looked at positioning PR. How can we actually help people use PR in their marketing, and then also cold email? How can you get someone interested in the first place? So that PR can actually help sway their opinion and potentially make them buy, or make you seem like an authority? Those are really the two things that we looked at. And then I guess for the Amazon bestseller, I wouldn't deem it to be that difficult to get. We just ran retargeting ads off of people that had similar interest. Basically, that's how we did it.

Carson Spitzke [00:22:06]:
We just paid for it. So it still counts. It still counts, right? And I can still use it. But a lot of things in this world, they may not be as authentic as it seems because I bought ads and I'm a bestseller now. So not exactly the hardest thing in the world.

Amber Stitt [00:22:20]:
Well, I think when you go down that avenue of learning that world, I think I've also heard that New York Times bestseller. It's all who you know.

Carson Spitzke [00:22:32]:
Yeah. Because if you know someone that can get you on their stage, or their show, or on TV, and you're able to sell 10,000 books, your ranking is way inflated. People might not like your book. Organic word of mouth. Very few books are actually like that. But if you have content marketing, you're boosting it to people. People are likely to buy.

Amber Stitt [00:22:51]:
Well, you've been so helpful, I think, even with that last statement, and I've talked about this before in other podcast episodes, I really think that our branding, our personal brand and our communication is really so important and that really, you got to pull that network together. Whether it's a community for thought leadership, community for network, for your business, there's so many ways now to have resources globally that you can generate so much traction and traffic. And I know that's where you specialize, but you can see the beauty behind the process. So it's really neat that you've been able to master this in such a quick amount of time. And you're not done.

Carson Spitzke [00:23:22]:
Nowhere near done.

Amber Stitt [00:23:23]:
Yeah.

Carson Spitzke [00:23:24]:
The other thing I think we mentioned this, but a lot of people my age, or beginner entrepreneurs look at is, "I'm not making XYZ per month. What the heck?" Versus they just need to do more, fail faster, and get the skills so that they can make it. I hate saying unreasonable, but it's unreasonable to make what they wanna make.

Amber Stitt [00:23:42]:
That's good. I think we all need to have some reflection there, but I think it boils down to having a little more patience, a little more grace with ourselves. But we have to keep at it. We gotta do the work.

Carson Spitzke [00:23:52]:
A lot more work is required, and it's under the surface, that's for sure.

Amber Stitt [00:23:56]:
But then hiring experts to help along the way, because most of the great experts are delegating, having that executive coaching, mentorship, or that team to be able to help out. So I know that you're able to help as needed. So we're gonna link up how to find you on the show notes and anything else you want to share before we wrap up today.

Carson Spitzke [00:24:14]:
I'd just say don't delegate too soon. There is value in knowing everything inside and out before you hire your first salesman, or hire someone to do your marketing, or hire someone to do your fulfillment.

Amber Stitt [00:24:25]:
I appreciate you saying that because I feel that people will say the sooner you hire for help, the sooner you free up your time and you can be more creative. And that's where the money can flow from. But I do think in my experience, too, having been initially a solopreneur, you're in the books. You're looking at sometimes, again, accounting, understanding money, taxes. Some of the things that I was looking at initially as a business owner, but tweaking, like how to get into an app and use it, when things are breaking, or need to be polished, or fixed, that's also a way that you can tell if you're leading a team, if there's someone that's doing their job, or not as well, eventually you can delegate out. Once you see that there's certain things that you don't love to do, hire for that. But I do appreciate you saying that because taking on sometimes overhead, too soon, too fast, that could be an issue.

Carson Spitzke [00:25:13]:
There is generally a reason why most large level CEO's are the best, or some of the best in their company at turning deals into actual revenue, or getting higher level clients into their pipeline in the first place.

Amber Stitt [00:25:27]:
That's great. I think that anyone that needs to feel that inspiration as they're daydreaming about their potential new thing, or just starting something from scratch, that you can really do it at any age. And I hope that for anybody. So it's been a pleasure. Thanks for hanging out with me today.

Carson Spitzke [00:25:43]:
Thanks for having me, Amber.

Amber Stitt [00:25:44]:
Thank you for joining us on this episode of Pathways. For more information about the podcast, books, articles, the blog, and so much more, please visit my website at: www.AmberStitt.com And remember, let's take action today! Thank you for listening!